Dieselpunk + Steampunk Culture
Dieselpunk Politics
I know it's a toxic subject but I've posted to my blog on the possibility of developing a set of criteria where certain political theories might be labeled as "dieselpunk." I would love feedback on what I've written.
http://dieselpunk44.blogspot.com/
~ Larry
http://dieselpunk44.blogspot.com/
~ Larry
Views: 15
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Tome Wilson on -
That's an interesting start, Larry.
I can't wait to see how you balance punk culture with an organized political view that isn't anarchy.
As an aside, it might be worth noting that the Kabukimono of Muromachi era Japan were the earliest recorded group that I've discovered living a "punk" lifestyle (as we understand that term today). Their antiauthoritarian lifestyle prompted the rise of a town protectorate class (the machi yakko), which later (d)evolved into the Yakuza (Japanese mafia).
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Permalink Reply by Larry on -
Thanks Tome.
I believe that the use of the phrase 'punk,' at least in this context, should not be automatically associated anarchism. Wiki has an interesting article on punk ideologies, which shows that while anarchism is dominant it's not essential to the phrase 'punk.' http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punk_ideologies
Thanks for the info on Kabukimono. I plan to learn more about them.
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Permalink Reply by Pablo J. Alvarez on -
I think, in my poor and limited expresion capacity, that the dieselpunk persons, live the sistem how somethings around them, but they don't feel, thenselves like a part of it. Like Samuel Dasiel Hammet in "Hammet" 1982 film.
Sorry for my english lenguage
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Permalink Reply by Beauregard on -
a very great article, Larry (and c'mon - sure you have readers, so theplural form is def. correct ;-) ).
I agree that the genre Dieselpunk itself has a stronger connection to actual contemporary politics than other genres when it comes to a story's background and overall setting.
However the term "punk" found in Dieselpunk, Steampunk, Cyberpunk etc. never really was hint for me personally that it has such connections.
"Punk" used in giving the child a name to me "only" stands for, say, "not normal". Meaning it's a not normal (probably a bit wicket) take on the past (or future).
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Permalink Reply by Larry on
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Just in case anyone missed it last Sunday I updated with part 2. Even those who don't feel that there may be a dieselpunk politics might find it interesting in that I explore with rather brief reviews of mainstream politics of that time.
http://dieselpunk44.blogspot.com/
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Permalink Reply by Ottens on -
Hey Larry,
I figured you'd be interested to know I've quoted from your excellent series, rather extensively indeed, in my latest article, "Dieselpunk as a Political Statement." Hope you enjoy it!
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Permalink Reply by Larry on
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Wow, thanks. Ironically I was considering raising the issue again with another example. This makes me consider it even more.
If you noticed in my recent blog on Carnivale I referenced you and Piecraft.
Ottens said:Hey Larry,
I figured you'd be interested to know I've quoted from your excellent series, rather extensively indeed, in my latest article, "Dieselpunk as a Political Statement." Hope you enjoy it!
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Permalink Reply by Damien Hewitt on -
Interesting.... I don't like that you mentioned Ayn Rand, but otherwise very interesting.
Ottens said:Hey Larry,
I figured you'd be interested to know I've quoted from your excellent series, rather extensively indeed, in my latest article, "Dieselpunk as a Political Statement." Hope you enjoy it!
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Permalink Reply by Larry on
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I understand. I'm not a fan of her either. Personally, I'm on the Left on nearly everything, including politics. I think Ottens is going down the same path that I was, which was to show that there are very different political philosophies that might share label "dieselpunk." It's not exclusively Left or Right.
Damien Hewitt said:Interesting.... I don't like that you mentioned Ayn Rand, but otherwise very interesting.
Ottens said:Hey Larry,
I figured you'd be interested to know I've quoted from your excellent series, rather extensively indeed, in my latest article, "Dieselpunk as a Political Statement." Hope you enjoy it!
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Permalink Reply by Caerulctor on -
If you read early science fiction, you discover that a lot of it is overtly political (and a good deal more of it is political in a more oblique fashion); and also that the politics are all over the map, going from the mainstream American capitalist ethic of the 20s and 30s right out to very extreme sentiments of both left and right. This isn't really surprising, since there were a lot of movements -- left, right, and center -- proposing utopian plans and solutions (utopian for them, anyway -- not always for everybody else) and what better place to offer utopian visions than science fiction?
A lot of it is actually pretty ugly, especially the racism; about every other early author has something to say about race, and it usually ranges from merely dumb to outright evil. Very little of it is about the domestic American situation, but more about the clash of rival imperialisms brought about by increasing globalization. The best that can be said is that, as time went on, there was some pullback from the more extreme positions.
Most authors espouse various forms of voluntaristic individualism, but that's an expected product of writing in the heroic genre -- your hero isn't much of a hero if he's at the mercy of large, implacable forces, and he's usually capable of changing the shape of the universe through his indomitable will.
But in the same breath, and especially after the onset of the Depression, there's a general acceptance that government is going to be doing a lot of the heavy lifting. The 20s is indeed the age of corporation-worship, and the individualistic heroes are often very rich men. But even in the 1920s, government wasn't exactly small, and hadn't been since before the World War; it was more marked by the interpenetration of big business and government. The 30s and 40s were the era of "Big Government", in one form or another, and there was a respect for social and governmental institutions (mixed with criticism) which is very unlike the indifference or contempt for them seen in, say, cyberpunk. After all, government was building things: roads, canals, dams, electrical grids, aircraft and it was anticipated that much of the world of the future was going to be created by government, in a planned and (hopefully) intelligent way -- which appealed to a lot of the people who were reading science fiction. With World War II, it became common wisdom that any big technological advance was going to be government-run, probably in a top-secret project based somewhere in the southwestern desert.
But all this wasn't considered incompatible with amazing individual achievements by the people who lived in that government-built future; it just meant that the heroes of the future were going to be going to ever stranger places to find the proper sphere in which to display their excellence.
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Permalink Reply by Damien Hewitt on
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Sweet. Good to know there are other Lefties in this trend :D
Larry said:I understand. I'm not a fan of her either. Personally, I'm on the Left on nearly everything, including politics. I think Ottens is going down the same path that I was, which was to show that there are very different political philosophies that might share label "dieselpunk." It's not exclusively Left or Right.
Damien Hewitt said:Interesting.... I don't like that you mentioned Ayn Rand, but otherwise very interesting.
Ottens said:Hey Larry,
I figured you'd be interested to know I've quoted from your excellent series, rather extensively indeed, in my latest article, "Dieselpunk as a Political Statement." Hope you enjoy it!
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